Anti-wolf activist Ron Gillett arrested for assaulting Lynne Stone
“Anti-wolf activist arrested for assaulting wolf advocate. Anti-wolf activist Ron Gillett allegedly attacks wolf activist
Lynne Stone says she took pictures of the Anti-Wolf Coalition director, then he grabbed and shook her.” By Rocky Barker. Idaho Statesman.
Added 3-28. Anti-wolf activist charged with assault and battery. Ron Gillett arrested for allegedly assaulting wolf advocate Lynne Stone. By Jason Kauffman. Idaho Mountain Express Staff Writer
Added – Video of Ron Gillett at Anti-Wolf Fundraiser :
Dr. Ralph Maughan is professor emeritus of political science at Idaho State University. He was a Western Watersheds Project Board Member off and on for many years, and was also its President for several years. For a long time he produced Ralph Maughan's Wolf Report. He was a founder of the Greater Yellowstone Coalition. He and Jackie Johnson Maughan wrote three editions of "Hiking Idaho." He also wrote "Beyond the Tetons" and "Backpacking Wyoming's Teton and Washakie Wilderness." He created and is the administrator of The Wildlife News.
134 Responses to Anti-wolf activist Ron Gillett arrested for assaulting Lynne Stone
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It would be edifying to learn the reasons why Gillette was released on his own recognizance after he had been arrested for and charged with assault and battery. For some reason, this doesn’t sound like common practice. Can anyone out there enlighten us?
I hope Lynne is ok. One of these days Ron Gillette is going to push the wrong person and end up in the hospital instead of going to jail.
There was a “No Contact Order” issued by Custer County that says Gilett must stay 300 feet away from her. This order was in place before Gilett was allowed to be released from jail on his own recognizance.
Stone remains a bit shaken up with a sore hand and arm. She says she is relieved that a “No Contact Order” was issued. There have been several other incidents where Gillett followed and harassed her. One involved 3 women on the highway west of Stanley. These were also reported to Custer County law officials.
Some attacks on Stone are being made on Rocky Barker’s article in the Idaho Statesman today. Stone says they are “flat out lies.”
Well, I guess this is not a huge suprise. The man is obviously enraged and irrational, in my opinion.
I truly hope Lynne is okay. This should get some press in a larger venue too. It should shed light on the polarization of the two sides of this issue. It isn’t being seen as the catalyst for nation wide, if not world wide, change in managing endangered species.
I hope she sues him, so that can be made public too. Aside from th emotional damage and physical pain she has endured, she has suffered this man’s tongue lashing for so long. There needs to be the lesson that bullying people is not the way to handle anything. (Although cattlemen have bullied the control of public lands away from the public.)
Stone is a strong woman, and she will obviously muddle through. I wish her well.
The men in my family, and most true “cowboys”, would say…
“Why don’t you come pick on a man your own size?” This shows how cowardly Mr. Gillett is. No man with integrity would let him speek on their behalf in the light of this. Abuse is abuse. Period.
I agree with you entirely here. What I don’t understand is that when an entire society, the western cowboy/multiple use culture, which has acted for over a century collectively as Ron Gillette has acted individually in abusing land, wildlife, and people, a fact that is undeniable, you advocate “communication.”
That some cowboys are nice doesn’t wipe away the ecological, political, social, and economic damage done and being done even now by the culture. Communicating with the few does nothing to change what the many have done and are continuing to do. Wolves, bears, elk, bison, bighorn sheep, etc., are worse off now than they were 30 years ago. Recovery of wolves and bears doesn’t mean much if their protections are lifted and under state management they are faced with the free for all that wolf opponents have promised.
At every turn, wildlife are losing. All that the collaboration and communication rhetoric that fills people with hope is doing is hiding what is happening on the ground. It’s clear enough if you look at the ground instead of listening to the rhetoric.
Ron Gillette isn’t just expressing himself; he’s also expressing a culture that is pervasive and inherently violent and destructive. To deal with what the many are doing one has to fight. It’s collective self-defense.
It’s not environmentalists who declared “war.” It is that bad.
Gillette, needs to be monitored very closely, his pattern of behavior has escalated substantially over the years concerning the wolves..he is following a very predictable path that is prevalent in another sector of society and that is the path that often ends up in serious injury or death in a domestic abuse situation. Now that it has reach this point, he has lost any semblance of self control that he may have had at one time. Having worked with abuse victims in the past, once this line is breached, the level of anger as well as the level of violence normally gets worse. The county officials need to take this incident very serious and make sure it is not cast aside as a mistake..I would strongly suggest that anyone that has occasion to interact with Gillette in the future, do so with the utmost caution and diligence..
Two years ago a stranger came to my booth at the Mountain Mama’s Art Show in Stanley and started to berate me for daring to have wolf photographs for sale. Some one who knew him pulled him out of my booth and away. I asked and was told that this crazy asshole was Ron Gillett.
He is not rational and needs some jail or institutional time.
Lynne deserves our support; she’s a great woman; her dedication to wolves is phenomenal and is to be applauded.
Gillett is a dangerous man; a time bomb that could explode at any time. He deserves some jail time and possibly some time in some type of institution that could begin the process of rehab.
“My name is Ron Gillett, and I used to hate wolves.”
I find it appalling that he was released on his on recognizance, when there was an order in place against him approaching her!!!
Lynne has made it no secret about her fears of him, for herself as well as others.
I wish to give Lynne my best wishes and support. I find her strong will and passion an inspiration. She is truly an amazing person. And have hoped someday to watch the wolves of Idaho with her. Is the gathering still on in June???
I hope she recovers from this traumatizing series of incidences with this crazy man Gillett. He must really be intimated by her in so many ways to brazenly and physically attack her and try to steal her camera.
Maybe she will sue and own his resort there in Stanley and turn it into a “Wolf Watching and Protection” operation. Howls that for Karma??
The reason he was released is because they issued a protection order, at least that is the way I am reading it, not that there was a protection order already in place, if the protection order was already in place, I am sure he would have been held and could not have been released without seeing a judge and possibly posting bond…I am pretty sure this has been charged as a misdemeanor if the protection order had been in place, it would have been elevated to a felony…at least that is the way it happens in most states, but of course I am not familiar with the ins and outs of Idaho laws..
I did not realize there was already a restraining order against him. This makes the decision to release him on his own recognizance even more incomprehensible. It seems deliberate.
It’s Custer County folks.
I hope she sues him and gets his land and turns it into a wolf preserve. Maybe we should all go to Stanley wearing wolf T shirts. Maybe that would, for good, push him over the edge of the mental health precipice that he is teetering on.
“There was a “No Contact Order” issued by Custer County that says Gilett must stay 300 feet away from her. This order was in place before Gilett was allowed to be released from jail on his own recognizance”
Which I read to say, they issued one, before they released him, not before the incident happened, often times in a domestic violence violation, the perpetrator is given the “no contact” order at the jail, before he can be release on his own recognizance…This is the way, I read what Ralph posted, he assaulted her, he was arrested for assault and battery, was issue a citation, that included a “no contact” order and then released, in other words, he can have no further contact with her, until such time as the case is adjudicated..
That is correct.
Save Bears is right.
I have a story of an encounter with Mr. G. waaay back in 1993.
I am a small female and he is a burly/fat six footer. I was operating a bus for a river rafting transport outfit in Stanley all summer and late in the season I had the misfortune to encounter this clown out in the Frank Church Wilderness, about 8 miles in. He was vehemently insistent that I had to get out of his way as he was on his way back to town with an empty bus. I was heading in to Boundary Creek “put-in” and had clients on board, a small wheelbase trail in tow, and several hundred feet past the nearest pullout around the bend behind me.
Mr. G. pulled right up to my bus, radiator to radiator on a one lane forest road on a mountain pass, screaming at me to get out of his way.
I calmly insisted that I had the right of way and that he could just back up into the pullout about ten feet behind his bus.
He then threatened to get me fired when he got back to town.
I told him he’d be doing me a favor and was welcome to get me fired when he got back to town, but first he’d need to back up into the pullout behind him so I could get by him and out of his way so he COULD go back to town and get me fired. Otherwise, we could be there all morning until he figured it out.
He kept threatening me to the point of flinging himself out of his bus and stormed over to my bus screaming epithets and such. My clients were stunned. If they hadn’t been there, I am certain he would have physically assaulted me right there.
Finally, he decided that I was not going to obey his commands and since there were witnesses, he chose to get back in the bus, grinding the gears hard, backed up and barely gave me room to pass.
I blew him a kiss as I slowly inched by him. I don’t know what the passengers did by means of thoughtful gestures out the windows but he was cussing at them too. I was kind of hoping he’d have a heart attack or something to teach him a lesson for being such a pig.
When I delivered my clients to Boundary Creek, they gave me a standing ovation and a nice tip. Kind of made it worth the trouble.
He’s out of control, has been for some time and is now, obviously, unable to control his most offensive abusive behavior in public.
For those that are pro wolf, fortunately Ron is his own worst enemy as well as HIS own best friend, which is normally the case with these types of individuals, he just does not realize as the vocal mouthpiece for his cause, he is doing far more harm, than good, I hope Lynn is okay, as I don’t like to see anyone physically hurt, and there is no reason for it, I do hope the authorities stand up and take notice of this, because it could lead to more physical confrontations with those who are pro wolf..these types who are prone to the escalation of violence, do not get better, they may become quiet, but there is another trigger point that WILL set him off, I just hope there is no one in the way.
Physical violence is a mental condition, that is difficult to treat, and based on his past, he is definitely one that needs to be strongly treated, under the supervision of mental health professionals…he is showing the progressive signs of mental deterioration and reasoning power, which in fact is an illness that often times can be treated, unfortunately at his age, as well as background, it could be difficult…and is only successful in about 30% of the cases…
As I said earlier, I would strongly suggest anyone who has occasion to interact with him in the future, please take the utmost care and be very serious about it..in other words folks, be VERY careful when you are around him in the future….
Let me get this straight: the restraining order was issued as a prerequisite to releasing him on his own recognizance after he was arrested for assault and battery? Is this standard practice?
Yes, it is in most jurisdictions in the US, especially when it is a first offense…As I said, I have worked with domestic violence victims and normally this is a first step, unfortunately, it is not the best step, anyone that resorts to this type of violence, should be required to talk to a mental health professional that is versed in domestic abuse, As Ms. Stone and Gillette have history, there should have been a 24 hour hold put on him, until such time as he could be evaluated, unfortunately now, he has been charged, for what he believes was his right, and will focus on her as a pinpoint of his frustration as well as anger….
He needs to spend some time with someone familiar with this pattern, he has hit a wall, or a trigger point, that will escalate in the future..
As I said, be very careful out there folks, especially when dealing with Gillette, he is what we call a ticking time bomb, and he could actually drag some of his cronies into it with him…
Working with Abuse victims, I take this type of action VERY serious…
I don’t know who the Ron Gillette that you had the confrontation with was, but the Ron Gillette that used to run the Triangle C rafting outfit in Stanley (he’s sold it now) stands all of about 5’8″ or 5’9″ and must weigh about 150 or 160.
“Burley, fat six footer” doesn’t even come close. I’ve known him for about 20 years.
That surely doesn’t excuse anything about his behavior but the man is not anywhere near that big.
Well, it was a wild guess as to his actual height, but he’s still looked pretty “round” whenever I saw him then. My point was, he’s bigger, by weight at least, and has no second thoughts about fiercely approaching someone while in a rage. there is no reasoning with this clown and he should be p;aced in facility to keep him from just running out and accosting anybody he deems worthy of his vile presence and its implicit negative content.
I don’t care who knows him, he isn’t safe to be let out, even in the wilds of Stanley from the looks of it.
“I hope she sues him and gets his land and turns it into a wolf preserve”
It’s a nice thought but his place is right in the middle of dowtown (such as it is) Stanley. Would not make very good wolf habitat.
Thank you for the information. I will say that it makes no sense, but then, much of the law as it is doesn’t make sense.
I would agree with you; the problem now is that he might drag some of his buddies into this, and they’re under no restraining order–not that, as it seems, restraining orders mean all that much.
It has not been my impression that people like Ron Gillette are amenable to therapy, given the culture he comes from and the unhealthy focus he seems to have on wolves to the exclusion of anything else. It doesn’t seem that you can deal with what he is, but only with what he does. That seems true of all too many people we run into who are of the “multiple use” persuasion, such as the fellow in Montana who talked publicly about putting a bullet into the head of a woman conservationist at a Forest meeting.
Same guy Layton. I hope Lynne is ok and that is as bad as it gets. It is amazing that people can reach that point. As save bears put it, he is his own worst enemy.
I don’t think it is fair to say Ron Gillett is the paradigm of ranchers Robert. Aren’t you the one who keeps comparing ranching to slave labor? As save bears would probably tell you there is his type in every demographic.
Save Bears, thank you for all the information. I appreciate your clearifing the “No Contact Order” misunderstanding.
As this is not his first encounter with Lynne, it maybe his first offense. Lynne, has been warning people about him as you have for quite sometime. I’m sure she appreciates your stressing the point in her behalf. I hope the courts take it as seriously as you have pointed out.
Actually, I referred to multiple use, not ranching. And my point is that we constantly run across people like Gillette more than perhaps you’d like to admit. The fact is, there is a strong component of violence in western culture, where it’s considered legitimate to lash out violently against those you don’t like. Conservationists make a good target, especially women conservationists. Intimidation of opponents is the response of first choice here in the West, and subsequent responses escalate from there in the wrong direction. I object strongly to that.
Do you deny it?
Why hasnt lynn posted here yet>>?
Could it be she is busy developing some more psycho angry man photos for her site….both these individuals need to GROW UP!!!!!
She is under no obligation to post to my blog. At any rate, the extent of her injuries are being evaluated today. The Stanley clinic was closed yesterday.
She has some photos of the “psycho angry man.” I’ve seen them. You describe them well. Ralph Maughan
Oh for cryin’ out loud Robert,
Now you are letting your pathological hatred of ranching and cowboys color your opinion of anybody in the west. Aren’t you getting just a bit carried away??
To accuse people from the west as somehow being more prone to violence and especially violence toward females is just so much BS.
If you dislike the west so much — why are you still here?? Seems to me that you ought to take some kind of a chill pill and loosen up your hatband a bit.
Ron Gillette is a stupid little moron — fortunately he is no more typical of western culture than you are. There are red eyed radicals on BOTH sides!!
Sounds to me like you’re denying the facts. Ask the women conservationists in the West who have been stalked, had dead animals left on their doorsteps, suffered from threatening and harrassing phone calls night on end, and received threatening letters, aside from being assaulted like Lynne. If you want to claim that it’s happens all over, well, fair enough. The KKK works that way too wherever you find it.
A little off-topic, sorry about that, but….
Robert Hoskins says: “That some cowboys are nice doesn’t wipe away the ecological, political, social, and economic damage done and being done even now by the culture. Communicating with the few does nothing to change what the many have done and are continuing to do. Wolves, bears, elk, bison, bighorn sheep, etc., are worse off now than they were 30 years ago.”
I don’t accept for one moment that a person as eloquent and intelligent as yourself can actually blame ‘cowboys’ for the environmental ills of the West.
The vast majority of ecological damage in the West is directly attributable to large corporations whose business is primarily natural resource extraction and the influx of large numbers of new residents into the West.
How many gas wells are in the West? How many acres of forests have been logged? What is happening to the air quality out West? What is happening to wildlife habitat as parts of the GYE have become among the fastest growing residential areas in the U.S.? What ecological changes have climate change wrought in the West so far? What has caused these hard and long droughts? What are the far-reaching affects of the large-scale mining out west?
Robert, I would like to let you know that of all those ecological problems just mentioned, not a single one can be attributed to ‘cowboys”. I am not a cowboy; hell, I have never sat on a horse in my life. Have no interest in ever doing so, either.
But put the blame where it belongs: on big business, not ‘cowboys’. And big business works hand-in-hand with our government officials so that the U.S. economy is supplied with the natural resources it requires to function.
Do you personally use oil, natural gas, metals, electricity, wood products, etc? Where else will these products come from if we exclude our public lands from any use whatsoever?
And blaming ‘cowboys’ for the West’s environmental ills is ignoring the reality of the West’s history of exploitation.
I advocate communication because to do otherwise would make me as barbaric as those who you oppose.
They have communicated on some small level. Maybe you could learn to communicate too, and I mean no offense. I have just noticed that you have a tendancy to be somewhat abbrasive when you make a point. I also admitt to the same myself.
I would say you boast a wealth of knowledge, but your presentation and written demeanor make it very hard to agree with you. I think you would get a lot more people to see things your way if you just stated things a little more kindly and with a bit more compassion.
Remember, no man is right 100% of the time, but a good man is gracious all of the time.
I’ve been a wildlife biologist with the Nez Perce Tribe Wolf Program since 1997. I have to side with Layton on this one that to make broad generalizations is to misrepresent all sides of the wolf issue. The efforts Lynne Stone has taken to prevent wolf-livestock conflicts most assuredly deserve recognition and praise. Ron Gillette’s actions in physically assaulting her most assuredly deserve scorn and criticism. One summer evening in 1998 (maybe 1999), while I was living in Stanley and almost daily monitoring the Stanley Basin pack, a woman that I did not know at the time, knocked on our residence door and as soon as I swung it open began a verbal tirade (with some expletives thrown in). She was very upset as to why we couldn’t just leave the wolves alone and do something to remove the livestock that were present within the pack’s home range. I attempted to explain the wolf program’s strategies/motives behind our management direction, but made little impression on the guest. After a mostly unsuccessful communication she went away unsatisfied and still upset, and I was left wondering about the very impassioned (if not hostile) visitor. A few days later I learned the identity of that woman- Lynne Stone. She has changed her style from confrontation to one that engenders tolerance/cooperation, while still maintaining her strong pro-wolf stance. I respect her passion and sincerely feel she has prevented the deaths of numerous wolves through her efforts. While I doubt Mr. Gillette is capable/willing to alter his viewpoints/behavior, I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt for now, but still don’t condone his actions.
Thank you all for your information about the latest mess in Stanley. I have hopes of spending some time in Stanley this summer volunteering with Lynne. This confrontation and the atmosphere in Stanley makes me a little bit uneasy about going there. This may be a stupid question, but are there any local pro-wolfers in Stanley other than Lynne? Maybe I just keep reading about the anti wolf people in the Stanley area? Thanks for any input from everyone.
Go with Lynne, you will have a ball. Ron Gillett is an aberration, albeit a dangerous one as has been well documented. If he shows up just leave without confrontation.
Carry bear spray, you should anyway. If he becomes confrontational and is unarmed and you cannot avoid him, drop him. Then call the sheriff ASAP.
Stanley has plenty of good people as well as weirdos. Don’t let this guy have any control over your life.
I think the atmosphere in Stanley toward wolves is now either neutral to pro-wolf. They’ve had them around for more 12 years now and nothing much ever happens except for an occasional dead calf or sheep, and the ranchers who lose them don’t live in Stanley anyway. They bring them in, in late spring.
The holdouts are some old-line families and a few men around town. I think of Stanley as safe, except for you know who.
Thank you everyone. I have visited Stanley many times and really love the area. I know you know who is not representative of the people of Stanley…but since I don’t live there, it is hard for me to judge the atmosphere. I spent 3 weeks in Yellowstone last year and the people in the Cooke City area seem very supportive of the wolf (at least of the dollars it brings in).
Thanks to everyone who spends the time and effort in trying to do the right thing. I am really saddened by the delisting and pray that somehow it will be stopped.
For those that are unaware, Lynne has been recovering from a recent surgery. I’m sure that getting roughed up by this holigan didn’t help her recovery. Hopefully she’ll sue the bastard.
Smokey Man…..are you serious…cowboys, ie the livestock industry isn’t responsible for ecological destruction in the West!
Have you visited Montana and witnessed the stream, wetland and riparian degredation and overgrazing in our National Forests? I see it every time I fish or hike in these areas. The livestock industry IS big business and they make a mess of our public lands.
Mom I give you my full support. Thank You for holding your ground yesterday. Your friends and family all have your back. Get well soon. Its unfortunate an incident like this can happen in a beatuiful place like Stanley. I wonder if the attacker will ever have the ability change this type of behavior? If not, I wonder what will happen to him in the future.
Webmaster note: Bryan is Stone’s son. He lives in SLC, I believe.
I tell you without a doubt the livestock industry hurts the public areas we are suppose to be able to enjoy. On Silver creek over in Picabo, a rancher was letting his cattle graze right down in the creek, I am here to tell you that the fishing has never been the same there. I even called the BLM and reported it. Its a shame that this should even have been allowed to happen. Look out how badly the sheep herders tear up the hills where they are running their sheep. Those sheep don’t leave much for the wild animals to eat. Yes Ron Gillette needs to pay big for this one. Lynne had told me about other run-ins with him. Yes it would have been funny if she would have gave him a big knee to the groin area or sprayed him with bear spray. I have said for a long time now, one of these days Ron is going to mess with the wrong person and the results will not be in his favor.
you are right that they are responsible, but so are miners and polluters, and everyone who ever ate beef or bought charcoal.
This particular person seems to be abusive. My guess is he may have been violent to women other than just Lynne Stone. That seems to be how it is. When they finally get caught hitting some one, they probably got away with it for years first.
I wonder what his wife has to say about her husband man-handling a woman?
there was another aritcle in the bozeman paper today, where another wolfpack has been designated to be “controlled” or “managed”
I wonder what the livestock industry in Idaho grosses a year? Or even the industry in Wyoming, Idaho and Montana?
Does anyone know? I might add perspective.
Regardless of how much money this guy has under his belt, he is an abusive bully and a butthead, and he can’t buy himself a conscience. That seems to be what he needs most.
there was another aritcle in the bozeman paper today, where another wolfpack has been designated to be “controlled” or “managed”
Just to clear a bit of confusion that might have emerged on this thread. Ron Gilette is not a rancher. He operated, may still operate a river floating business in Stanley, and he has a motel and a store.
First, I would like to say thank you to all who have expressed concern after yesterday’s physical attack on me by Ron Gillett. I have a very sore and partly numb hand, arm and shoulder and am shaken up.
The case against Gillett is under investigation, so I cannot reveal all what transpired. Rocky Barker’s story was a bit inaccurate. I was not watching wolves when Gillett appeared. The wolves were around that morning, but had moved on.
There have been some postings on this website and others that I feel need a response from me at this time. Gillett is under a “No Contact Order” which means he has to stay 300 feet away from me and 100 feet away from my vehicle. I am hoping this will stop him from following me and preventing incidents, which like happened yesterday within the city of Stanley.
I do fear for my safety, but this is my home and where I want to live. I met a former wife of Gillett’s this past summer who told me he threatened to kill her several times and she had to get a restraining order.
Sal – you are much more accurate in your description of Gillett’s size, although he’s probably 5’10.
Ralph – Ron Gillett used to have a day float business in Stanley called Triangle C. He sold it a few years ago. He also used to be a big game guide. Currently he has several cabins for rent and is trying to sell them and his residence. I’m not sure of the latest asking price but it’s $3 million or more.
And sometimes, wolves can be seen from where Gillett lives on the west edge of Stanley. Like yesterday morning and today.
I wish you a full recovery for your physical and emotional wounds. You are a “leader and an inspiration.” I will keep you in my thoughts.
The fact that this man is not a rancher makes his stance even more puzzling. I don’t question his abusive nature, I just believe it is his nature. So in that, perhaps being hateful toward others is too.
I would just hope we aren’t using him as the yard stick to measure all men by.(Or even all people who oppose wolves. I know some people will state that ranchers and cattle abuse the land. That is true. But that doesn’t mean everyone who opposed wolf reintroduction would use violence against women to make their point or get their way.)
Lynne, welcome back. And be safe.
I’m interested in volunteering this summer for the Boulder-White Clouds Council and just now sent an email to your organization. I’ve spent very little time in Idaho and something tells me I should go. 🙂
Please Mack, stay out of Idaho. We have too many of your kind as it is.
I find it amazing that over the years the press has frequently allowed the lunatic Gillette to represent the “anti” side of wolf recovery. By giving this loser a voice in the debate reflects very poorly on the media concerning this issue. This violent, deranged asswipe has in ways had his views and opinions validated by the media exposure given to him over the years. Now the responsible thing for the media/press to do is write a story on how this anti – wolf cowboy/crusader has a propensity to physically harm women, at least in this case.
Keep up the great work Lynne.
That’s really interesting. I was being harrassed a few years ago when I was posting wolf advocacy comments on a forum; I got threatening e-mail messages telling me to “stop posting or else,” hunting information in the mail (silly), threatening phone calls and more. I finally called the sherriff but they said they couldn’t pinpoint who was doing it. I would think there’s a way to track e-mails.
It would also be interesting to see how many vehemently anti-wolf males are also domestic abusers. I think it’s a control thing more than anything else — I have long believed that people who are so against wolves have an unresolved control issue as wolves are so intelligent and self-sufficient and are truly a “match” for man. That’s what makes them so wonderful and why we love our dogs so much as they are 99.8% DNA wolf.
March 27, 2008 at 9:00 am
Please Mack, stay out of Idaho. We have too many of your kind as it is.
Hey, Dave, as a free America, I’ll travel and live wherever I damn well please.
I guess it would also be interesting to see how many vehemently pro wolf females hate men….I have long believed that people who are so in love with wolves have unresolved issues with men….that may explain their close relationship with dogs…….domestic abusers…give it a break…(Barb…please both of these extreme views don’t really hold much water…do they>>?)
I know a lot of women who are pro-wolf. My spouse is one of them.
I almost always find that they are intelligent, not men-hating, and generally not a boring, plain vanilla kind of woman.
Most of them own guns, however. They often have them at hand. So watch out!
Mack…..sounds like Dave doesn’t think much of someone who stands up for women. Hey…I’ll join you.
Ralph…in case you didnt notice the text in parentheses….this is not my view…just a ridiculous spin on the ridiculous comment posted by Barb reference a connection between domestic violence and relationship to wolves……
Dave, there is a name for people who only want a certain type of person (one without an opinion, or who agrees blindly) with a certain point of view in an area of the United States or anywhere else….they’re called communists! (or nowdays, republicans.) I’m not trying to stir anything up, but geez this country was built on diverse ideas for crying out loud. Keeping people away from somewhere because they don’t share your view…. how historically original!
By the way, Dave, interesting that you have “too many of Mack’s kind.” That implies that your viewpoint is in the minority which in a democratic society should translate to policy. I’d say you’re pretty lucky to live where you live.
Great, jerry b, let’s go. We’ll see some great country and meet some great people. Let’s take this to private email.
Lynne, I am glad you were not too hurt, and I thank you for helping save our wolves and wildlife. I do not know you but you are a brave and committed person, we need more like you out in Montana, Idaho and Wyoming. but please, take this advice and get a TASER GUN, Bear spray is for bears, Stun/Taser guns are for fools…aim for the middle section of the groin area too on Ron!!!! Blessings to you and may all spirits keep you and the wolves safe!
jerry b said: “Smokey Man…..are you serious…cowboys, ie the livestock industry isn’t responsible for ecological destruction in the West!”
I didn’t say that cowboys haven’t caused any environmental harm. What I stated was a clear and obvious fact: cowboys are responsible for a very small percentage of historical environmental damage in the West.
Who logged over 95% of the old-growth forests of the West?
Who owns the mines that dump millions of pounds of mercury into the Western environment each year?
Who has built the thousands of subdivisions in the West that has directly and permanently destroyed vast tracts of Western land?
Who owns the huge aluminum mining firms of the West?
Who has put up those tens of thousands of gas wells across the west, diminishing air quality and destroying wildlife habitat at the same time?
Who has bought the oil and gas leases on our Western National Forests, often in great wildlife habitat, thus bringing industrial development into the center of those National Forests?
Who has punched all those thousands and thousands of miles of roads into the west’s National Forests so they could cut down forest after forest?
A hint to the answers to the above questions: ‘cowboys’ aren’t the correct response to any of those.
I have many more examples, but this post is long enough.
So, can you really equate some streamside damage from cows with millions of pounds of mercury being released into the West’s environment each year?
Can you compare some over-grazing of public lands with the industrial removal of 95% of our west’s old-growth forests?
Stop blaming the cowboy, that is just a small guy doing his job. The real culprits are large natural resource extraction corporations. These guys are doing wholesale, permanent, and wide-reaching damage to the West today, just as they always have.
Another spin Says:
March 27, 2008 at 10:28 am
I guess it would also be interesting to see how many vehemently pro wolf females hate men….I have long believed that people who are so in love with wolves have unresolved issues with men….that may explain their close relationship with dogs…….domestic abusers…give it a break…(Barb…please both of these extreme views don’t really hold much water…do they>>?)
To Another Spin, all I can say to the above is you are one ignorant human. I love the wolf due to it beauty, grace and and because it is so persaqueted by humans. Yet if given half a chance they thrive. I also have personal contact with wolves and they are one of the most loyal and protective species there is if they care for you. My love of wild life and nature in general has nothing to do with if I like a man or not. I love men, but I am a strong willed and voiceful woman with what I belive in, alot of men are to intimidated by my kind of woman. Hope that clears up a bit of what you think…
Why do the conversations always have to drop to the depth of depravity? I admire Lynne for her courage and her continued work to bring out truths, but advocating violence is not right either…and it does not matter what side of the coin you are on, Gillette was wrong, and is showing a pattern or escalation in his actions…the man needs help…and the majority need to stay rational, if their point of view is going to prevail.
Classic social psychology.
Attitudes perform 4 or 5 functions for individuals (after Daniel Katz): (1) instrumental (2) knowledge (3) value-expressive (4) ego defensive (5) others add social adjustment.
I think that for most people in Idaho regarding wolves: 3 and 5 are dominant, but for those who are likely to attack someone and known for strident, poorly informed remarks no. 5 is predominant. (3) social adjustment probably explains anti-wolf sentiment in many rural communities because residents perceive that wolves are disliked.
This also raises the issue of possible “false consensus” — when people adjust their attitudes to conform to the “dominant” view, when the dominant view in fact is in the minority. I think this happens in at least some rural communities in Idaho, especially where economic change and in-migration is underway.
I agree to a point, although when one is attacked, it is one’s right to respond with a degree of violence that will stop the attack. Pacifism and concern for the other loses all credibility when it is your own life on the line.
Since you have experience with these matters, it would be helpful if you could help us to understand the law as it relates to them. Specifically, if someone like Ron Gillett, who has been violent and unstable all his life, but has avoided accountablity for it because he lives in a culture that condones or excuses violence, what would be necessary legally to put him away where these problems can be addressed? That is, what is necessary to convince a court to commit a violent, unstable individual to appropriate care? I think this is an important question.
I grew up in the very violent South during the Civil Rights era, and what we’re seeing here is all too reminiscent of what I grew up with forty years ago. This just isn’t a “coincidence,” or something that just got out of hand, as IDFG’s Steve Nadeau is quoted as saying today in a story on the assault in the Twin Falls newspaper. It goes far deeper, just as racism went far deeper than what we saw on the surface in the South.
Robert I am not advocating pacifism when you are directly attacked, when your attacked with the possibility of physical harm or even death,(I know a lot think this that is over stated) then I always advocate protecting yourself, you can either fight back, or retreat from the encounter in the safest and quickest method possible. The “Punch once, Run Twice” Do everything you can to protect yourself and then get the hell out of the situation!
I have been an advocate for many years now that in any violent situation that the perpetrator needs to be held for a minimum of 24 hours to be evaluated, I don’t believe in a ticket, a non-contact order and then release, because there is something going on that needs to be addressed, two pieces of paper and a slap, will not solve anything, and in fact it further infuriates the person arrested..
What scares me, is when mob mentality takes over, which it seems to be doing with a few in this thread, advocating violence against the perpetrator needs to be handled very carefully, because more often than not, it is not an effective defence, and will charge the situation further…
There are many on this blog that don’t have all the information required, myself included, that are making statements that will infuriate the situation..
Ron Gillette, now has a focal point for his anger, and unfortunately that is Lynne, and I do hope I am very wrong, but I can tell you, with what I know about him from years of watching his actions, I am concerned that his anger will overcome any semblance of common sense he may still have, which at this point in time, is very little..myself personally, would push to have this classified as a domestic violence charge, and any knowledgeable court would accept it, domestic violence, does not just happen in families, it happens when people have history, there is a history between Lynne and Ron, with both of them being on opposite sides of a very highly charged issue…
I agree this is far deeper than, an incident that got out of hand, it is a very serious situation that needs to be addressed, and I mean now, if the local authorities will not do something, I would get a hold of a federal prosecutor and brief them on what happened and fear of further violence..by restraining, Gillette actually violated Lynne’s civil rights as well
I will add, if I were in the same situation as Lynne was, he would have got a boot to the balls as well as two thumbs to the eyes, and then I would have got the hell out of there, when directly confronted like this, disable and retreat, but vengeance after the fact, by others that are mad, will never help, it just infuriates..
I’m still wondering what could be done legally to get Ron Gillett off the streets, or conversely, I would like to know if there is no legal process to take him off the streets, short of a criminal conviction that puts him in jail. What I know of domestic violence, which we had quite a bit of in the Army, is that if you don’t nip things in the bud you end up with someone badly hurt or dead. We had additional tools as commanders to deal with a violent individual (please, no snide comments from anyone about worrying about violent individuals in the military) but I don’ t know what tools are available in civilian life, specifically in Idaho.
Unfortunately Robert, there are no current solutions in Civil situations, that is why we as society, need to continue to lobby our lawmakers to change the laws, we had far more control in the Army in this type of situation, it seems the military has a better understanding, than the civilian authorities do..like I said, it should be mandatory, that a minimum of a 24 hour holding and evaluation period be instituted to actually observe and evaluate the person who has committed the act, I spent 26 years in the Army in special forces, I can be very violent, when the situation calls for it…but I also understand, that in civilian life there is far less understanding of what actually is transpiring in these types of situations…as I said, Lynne needs to contact a federal prosecutor, if she is not happy with the local authorities, because I don’t believe this was a “Situation that got out of hand”
First and foremost, just wanted to add my voice in wishing Lynne Stone a speedy recovery of all injuries and express my admiration for her continued advocacy on behalf of wolves and other wild things.
Regarding Ron Gillett, the man is clearly deranged. I have read of his exploits and heard him speak (not in person) and he seems to truly believe what he’s saying…every individual has the right to their personal opinion of wolves, but there are not 9,000 wolves in Idaho, and many of his statements over the years reveal a dangerously skewed perception of reality. It would not surprise me if views his assault on Lynne as “self-defense” (very unlikely he felt physically imperiled by her, but that he is justified in defending “his way of life” from people like Stone with violence…that she “started” it).
It is important to note that Gillett doesn’t merely dislike wolves, believe they have an unacceptable impact on Idaho, or wants delisting and/or opposed reintroduction… he pathologically HATES wolves and has spent most of his energy pursuing this hatred to ludicrous extremes. I believe there are many people who do not share my “pro-wolf world view” who are not stupid, crazy, violent, criminal, etc., and who would never dream of assaulting a woman for disagreeing with them. There is a very significant difference between someone who dislikes the presence of wolves because he/she believes wolves have a negative impact on hunting, and someone who considers wolves to be the major locus of all evil and the single greatest threat to life as we know it… and I think that difference manifests itself between an individual who will vote differently than I would on a public wolf management referendum, and an individual who might come at me from behind with a lead pipe for wearing a wolf t-shirt.
I don’t believe Gillett is typical of people who don’t like wolves, but I do think he is representative of a certain subculture (which does hate, among other things, wolves). This subculture may not be typical of rural Westerners, but like any such group in any region of the country, they find their pockets and toeholds in certain places where they can create a climate of fear and intimidation… every state in the Union has its “angry little towns” (I am not calling Stanley, ID an “angry little town”…other than Captain Crazy, I haven’t heard of this type of thing there), and where they occur in the rural West, anti-environmentalism seems to be one of their “things”. I think the real question is how local law enforcement deals with them. Do they protect the victim and attempt to bring the crazies to justice, or are they sympathetic good ol’ boys who give the crazies/haters the quiet nod? In the latter case, it’s a good example of how this subculture might not be indicative of the average small town Westerner, but can pose a very real danger and do some of the dirty work for some unscrupulous powers- that -be in maintaining the socio-political status quo.
What groups? I spent time in 5th and 10th Groups, and SWC. Left in 92 to come out here.
I was associated with the 5th, and was based out of Bragg, most of my career, I saw action in Grenada, Panama, Iraq and a few select places I can elaborate on! LOL I retired in 2006, I spent 10 active and then 16 non-active, subject to recall and they extended me 1 year after my drum out date, due to training qualifications…the non-active subject to recall, was due to an AK round I took in the hip, during the first gulf “WAR” I loved my time in, but can’t say I am unhappy to be out!
I live in the west, in a wolf recovery area, and I can tell you will 100% conviction, Ron Gillette, is NOT the norm, you are right he has a pathological hate, for both the wolf, as well as the government, it is not an “issue” with him, it is a life altering though process that eventually become all consuming, which is why I have great concerns over this last incident that has occurred…and I am not being disrespectful, but it is as bad as any of the hatred that certain groups have had for African Americans, Native Americans, or any other group that becomes an all consuming focal point, that becomes their whole goal in life, it is an obsession..
You are right, Gilett is not the norm for anti-wolf attitudes, although there are, as Robert Hoskins says, aspects of Idaho that develops people like Robert describes from the South. I think that the wolf is a flash point for them because it allows them to express their resentment in a safe way.
Is anyone familiar with the Authoritarian Personality studies over the years? . . . people who have developed this personality tend to be very aggressive toward those they perceive as below them, and I think that includes animals. They generally do not take on those they perceive to be above them in whatever way they measure social status or power. Ralph
We’ll have to connect sometime. Do you remember Col. James A. Guest? Later MG Guest? I was in 5th Group when he got rid of the Vietnamese colors in the flash. How about Maj. later Col. Jim Woolschlager? And the mad Russian Col. Vladimir Sobichevsky?
Don’t belong to the SF Association; always seemed to me to be a drinking club and I gave up drinking. I didn’t retire; left in 92 after 14 years. Was prior enlisted, 98G Arabic. The Army officer corps was getting just a little too much to bear. If you recall, there was a lot of talk of a RIF after the Gulf War and the scramble of conventional officers to get into SF to save their careers was ludicrous. You could see things going downhill. Things picked up after Bosnia I understand.
I got a charge out of the cavalry charge in Afghanistan by 5th group soldiers on Afghani horses. Right out of Flashman.
A young man from Dubois is in training at Bragg right now, 18B, but he says things are grievously bureaucratic, and from his description, things sound pretty bad. It appears SF is going through a difficult time organizationally. You could see that coming in the early 90s with all the new headquarters and barracks buildings going up. The USASOC HQ building was absurd. Empires everywhere. I’m glad I got out when I did. I don’t even miss jumping. Picked up horseback riding instead. More dangerous.
I am aware of a species that should be on the endangered species list: the Pin-Headed Western Mountain Redneck. The population level of the Pin-Headed Western Mountain Redneck is rapidly falling and some are blaming the decline on an evolutionary split. Also, seemingly more intelligent species, such as Homo sapiens, are moving into its territory and educating its young, which either immediately leave their habitat or stay and learn new behaviors, thereby irritating the hell out of the Pin-Headed Western Mountain Redneck. This sometimes causes it to eat its own words, which have been tested by reputable labs and found to consist mostly of bullshit. I am of the opinion that this is the one listing that the Bush administration could really get behind.
Not much to add on this thread, except:
1) Lynne, I am sorry you have to endure this kind of abuse and — heck, let’s call a spade a spade — TERRORISM from this rage-aholic stalker guy. He’s a pathetic excuse for a human being; we can feel sorry for what miserable life he has, but you’re wise to keep your guard up. I admire your courage and dedication.
2) There IS a noticeable pattern amongst these wackos. Anybody remember Chad McKittrick from Red Lodge? He shot Wolf #10 in April 1995. Another marginal (unemployed alcoholic) loser like Gillett, he found meaning and a modicum of approval in leading the crusade against reintroduced wolves. He even rode in the Red Lodge 4th of July parade, styling himself part of the “Wolf Reduction Team.”
I’ve seen other people (of both genders) like McKittrick and Gillett appoint themselves the defenders of the West on wolves and other topics. Almost invariably, it eventually comes out that these extremists have some serious deficiencies and problems in their private lives — impending divorce, criminal activity (such as drug dealing in one case), financial catastrophe, wayward children . . .
Policy scientists talk about this pattern as “displacement;” that is, rather than face up to the problems at home or in the mirror, these folks find something external to pour their energy into, to raise their esteem and status socially, and to avoid admitting their problems to themselves. Gillett, McKittrick, Chenoweth, Craig . . . ugh.
(Rbt Hoskins should weigh in here if he’s inclined — it would be edifying to me anyhow)
3) On the topic of blaming “cowboys,” it seems the difference of opinion is that Smoky rightly sees them as individuals, whereas Jerry B uses the term “cowboy” to stand for the whole livestock industry (“cowboys, ie the livestock industry”).
The livestock industry does (ab)use cowboy iconography for PR and political purposes, and so I can understand why you would let “cowboy” represent the entirety of the livestock industry. I’m disinclined to throw the cowboy out with the bathwater, though.
PS – Ralph, I like the Social Psychology concepts you presented, too.
I have an article in my files:
“Defensive Pride and Consensus: Strength in Imaginary Numbers,” Ian McGregor et al 2005, from J. Personality and Social Psychology.
Great quote: “The vast majority of North Americans rate themselves as well above average in self-esteem. This self-serving skew, together with the fact that self-reported esteem is not correlated with objective measures of esteem-worthiness suggests that for many, pride may be a defensive distortion.”
The substance of this article and the experiments they did are fairly complex, but it indicates that people with a lot to be defensive about often maintain some kind of stasis by fluffing up their pride, and by imagining that most everybody agrees with them (except for those who clearly qualify as enemies . . . namely, those who disagree!).
Although it’s not in the article in plain English, sometimes these people are forceful, super-confident, and maybe even a little scary, and that bullies the ambivalent into going along with whatever they say. I’ve seen that play out with numerous petition drives.
– – – – –
Thank you. SAP. Their attitudes are not those of typical anti-wolf people. Ego-defensive means they are defending the concept the have of themselves. In the case of McKittrick, he was someone who was not prospersing and wanted someone or something to blame.The attention he got improved his self-image for a while.. Ralph
Lynne thank you for posting. . and I want to add my hopes that you will recover quickly. I too have been threatened over wildlife and it is not a matter to take lightly. Please, please be careful and do not believe everyone, or relinquish your personal freedom i. e. accepting a ride with someone who looks innocent if you car breaks down etc. Woman do have rights these days, but they don’t matter in the wilderness when you are alone. . there you have be tougher and it is the one situation where you don’t have to explain everything, like what you are doing there and that you are alone. As a matter of fact, it is the one situation where I advocate lying or pretending to answer you cell phone when you have no service and telling the fake person on the phone where you are and who is talking to you. Using your camera was a right thing. I am sure you know all this but I wanted to remind you and other women who read these posts. You don’t have to stay out of the wilderness or politics, but think out things ahead of time that will keep you safer. Like my bear pepper spray that lives on my pack all the time and like being able to track so you know who else is there. Have a plan B and C, but most of all, we woman tend to want to help other people. . don’t automatically do that if you are alone.
I’m not sure just what you’re expecting here from me; I’m not interested in trying to put these guys through analysis, even if I have read Freud, Adler, Jung and Rollo May. That’s for the therapists, the MDs, the PhDs, and the academics.
I grew up in the “rural” South with the KKK during the Civil Rights era, which I doubt that many of the people on this blog did or have any comprehension of, and yes, these guys were psychopathological with the kinds of domestic or criminal problems that you’ve mentioned. I grew up too with men whose grandfathers and even fathers had fought in the Civil War, and there was no battle of the Civil War, with all its slaughter and destruction, that these old men didn’t remember as if they had been there themselves, and tell me about as well. Their stories could make me see lines of infantry shattered by musket and grapeshot or the screaming horses of cavalry flailing on the ground as they charged on line toward federal positions at–name your battle.
Violence structured everyone’s lives, even those of us who weren’t “psychopaths.” But back in those days the psychopaths, and there were not a few, given the poverty of the land, could beat the shit out of their wives and kids and their dogs too and no one would do anything about it. Not a few of these guys ended up dead when the little wife had all she could take and blew her drunken hubby’s head off with the shotgun that leaned up against the wall behind the wood stove or the kitchen door while he was sitting at the kitchen table with a bottle of local hootch in front of him. Or, a son did it. Occasionally, even a daughter. But also, you sometimes found the little wife dead in the bedroom and the kids hiding in the attic in terror, that is, if they weren’t dead too. Then people like my great grandfather, who was county sheriff, went in to pick up the pieces and arrest the drunken sod and hang him when he was found guilty and sentenced to hang by the neck until dead, God have mercy on his soul. It was the hangings that turned my great grandfather against sheriffing and he went back to his land holdings a century ago like Montaigne and wrote essays about the Revolutionary War until he died. No one remembers the essays but me.
That this kind of thing happened not infrequently in the rural South is just not something out of Faulkner.
Let’s not forget the beatings, the cross burnings, the burning of churches and homes, and lynchings of black people.
I grew up with these things. Has it influenced me? You bet it has.
The big problem was that by and large, the culture tolerated, condoned, or turned its eyes away from this kind of thing until it was too late and it was time for the hanging, or by the time I came around, to send the convict down to Raleigh’s Central Prison to fry. We see the same things here in the west with these various representatives of the “sub-culture” that identifies itself with natural resource extraction as keeping with God’s commandment to go forth and multiply and subdue the Earth until Jesus’ second coming. So many things are justified by blaming Jesus for it. I don’t imagine Christ cares much for it, but people are people and His salvation is for everyone.
As a conservationist, however, it’s not up to me to feel the pain of their existence, or worry about the salvation of their souls, but to see and understand and do something about the impacts on land and wildlife that the pathological expression of the values of their “subculture” commands and exonerates.
It is hardly pathological or displacing on my part that the damage that these people do enrages me and that I am determined to put a stop to it. Note, however, that I work toward legal and political means to put a stop to the destruction. I am not stalking ranchers, loggers, miners, drillers, bureaucrats, legislators, lobbyists or “cowboys” and threatening to kill them or beat them up or shoot their cows and sheep or blow up their dams or spike their trees or dump sugar down the gas pipes of their heavy machinery. I am engaging in the political process, which I believe used to be called democracy.
It would be nice if the opposition worked the same way and had just a little respect for democracy. But guess what. the opposition, whether individuals or corporations or trade organizations, has no respect for democracy. What it respects is power, whatever its source.
It seems to me that a lot of people in the conservation movement don’t realize just how fragile democracy is and how easily it can be destroyed. the Bush administration is giving us an inkling of it, but democracy has been hung high many times in our past.
The things we see going on around us, whether the slaughter of wolves or the willful disease infecton of bighorn sheep or streambeds chewed and churned by cows, name your problem, are a direct consequence of the lack of democracy in the West and the deliberate disenfranchisement of those of us who object to it.
What was it the Dixie Chicks sang: “We’re Not Ready to Make Nice”? Great gals. More people should listen to them.
Thanks for your thoughtful response, Robert. I didn’t expect you to put Ron Gillett on the couch, just wanted your perspective on these warped leaders, due to your varied experiences and deep erudition.
And I certainly hope I’d didn’t imply that YOU are displacing through your work. Not at all.
Myself, I have gone down the rabbit hole enough times to really fear for democracy — sat through enough meetings where bullies ruled and carried out thought control through intimidation.
It’s that kind of climate that emboldens the Gilletts of the world, plunges them deeper into their self-righteous delusions and anger. SOmetimes, they hurt one person like Lynne; other times it’s on a bigger scale. Not to in any way minimize what Lynne went through, but that kind of thing intimidates many people, especially when the law doesn’t effectively intervene.
I am just now reading “War Is A Force that Gives Us Meaning,” by Christopher Hitchens. It’s frightful to see that we are often just a few wrong moves away from Sarajevo.
Ralph I think you hit the nail on the head with your “false consensus” theory. Most Americans are unimformed about a lot of subjects like wolves or politics and just go with the flow or “dominant view.” Its hard to imagine that your best friend or mommy or daddy could be giving you bad information…they are always right, right? Its a very tough chain to break, and its not just rural communities that are afflicted, its everywhere.
Oh and Jimbob, Im a republican, not a communists. A republican who loves wolves and the environment, oxymoron?
I posted this on another thread but I realized this is the more appropriate one.
There is an advertisement in the Long Valley Advocate today for a public meeting in Cascade on April 2nd.
I would encourage anybody that would be interested in being physically assaulted by Ron to attend with a video camera and a can of pepper spray.
Here is the text of the ad:
￼CANADIAN WOLVES IN IDAHO
The Idaho Anti-Wolf Coalition (a non-profit, grassroots organization), will hold a public meeting in Cascade.
It will be held at the American Legion Hall April 2, 2008 at 7 p.m.
Chairman Ron Gillette will inform citizens about the ballot initiative for wolf management proposed by the IAWC.
Please visit our web site: http://www.saveourelk.com
WE NEED YOUR INPUT AND HELP!
I went to that website and all I can say is what a load of first class crap. I would love for those on that website to prove without a shadow of a doubt that anything thats on their website be the truth. I can also say without any doubts that any of the places they have listed as a supporter, I will no longer do business with. I think Ron Gillette should climb back on that short bus and take his seat.
I think a lot of people who donated to the Idaho Anti-Wolf Coalition should be asking some questions as to where their money is going. They have held numerous fund raisers to pay lawyers for a supposed lawsuit, which as far as I know never happened. Supposedly that auction they had a while ago raised thousands, or they are just BS’ing about that.
video of gillett added at post
The Idaho Statesman | Edition Date: 06-20-2004
“Gillett and the coalition are attracting big fund-raising crowds and big money. An Idaho Falls banquet brought 500 people and raised $35,000 for the non-profit, but not tax-exempt, group, he said. The coalition raised $120,000 in March. A supporter offered to build a house and sell it for the cause, Gillett said.
But Gillett won’t open his books. He would not give the total the coalition has raised. Critics say he has no accountability.
“I’ve always heard that Ron Gillett is stuffing his pockets with the money,” Gillett said.” (the person quoted apparently is misnamed)
Someone correct me if I’m wrong, but it is my understanding that all non-profits must immediately open their books upon request.
Sounds like an audit of Idaho Anti-Wolf Coalition is in order, and if any serious discrepancies are found, a request made of the IRS to revoke their non-profit status. Last I heard, the IRS doesn’t take kindly to those that try to screw it; some spend time in prison.
many prominent idaho politicians including “Butch” Otter, Helen Chenoweth, etc. were listed as donors to the anti-wolf coalition in a pamphlet that was distributed at the fundraiser in the meeting that Gillett is speaking at in the video above (August 2003)…
I agree 100%…..any one giving money to Gillett is throwing it away….even if (big big IF) he is using it for his cause it is wasted….However, I think the same holds true for those donating to the several interest groups trying to appeal delisting in court…this money will also be wasted…and to the wise please wait 120 days to argue with me…and if your smart hold on to your money…..
Depends on if he is actually federally recognized non profit, any group can claim to be non profit, but I also noted the article said they are not tax exempt. So it would take some investigation to find out if they actually are a recognized non profit group.
Save bears, if any group claims to be a non-profit but is not, they’re misrepresenting themselves. As you’re probably aware, there’s numerous catagories of federal non-profits; some are tax exempt, others are not.
I’ll find out if the yahoos have IRS non-profit status.
I am fully aware of the IRS tax laws as well as non profit status, I sit on the board of directors for a 503(c) organization, but I also know that many groups start claiming they are non profit, before their status paper work has been file or approved.
Save bears, it is my understanding that a group applying for non-profit status can, at the point they put their IRS 1023 (application) in the mail, begin operating; they just have to tell donors and potential donors that they don’t have their status but expect it within X (120) days.
Idaho Anti-Wolf Coalition has been around for years; the article above is dated ’04.
You are in fact correct on your understanding, but it does not mean they applied when they first started out. It actually should be easy to find out if they are in fact a legal non profit, and if they are, then their annual report will be public record…recognized non profits are required to have a board of directors as well as file annual reports..
A quick Guidestar.org search, which has a database of over 1.5 million legal non profits does not show a listing for them..
Save bears, thanks for checking.
This is very interesting… Back in ’04, there was talk of Ron Gillette not opening his (Idaho Anti-Wolf Coalition) books, not releasing the total the group has raised and he was accused of “stuffing his pockets with the money.”
Apparantly the Idaho Anti-Wolf Coalition does not have IRS non-profit status.
Anyone smell a rat here?
Sounds like the Idaho Anti-Wolf Coalition is ripe for investigation.
In my search, I also found another incident:
“Several months ago Ron was flying to Nevada for an anti-wolf conference. He flew out of boise on a small Horizon prop plane. Ron started up a conversation with the fellow sitting next to him and in a matter of minutes it was plainly obvious that he’d met his sworn enemy. His row-mate was the USFS scientist responsible for wolf reintroduction in Idaho. At which point, Ron became violent and was subdued by a male attendant and the USFS scientist. The pilot then returned to Boise where Ron spent a night in city lockup. He’s since been banned from flying….”
I found this on the democraticunderground.com website, can anyone verify this as truth? if so, it may be prudent for Lynne to know this going into this case, as it may esculate the level of severity in the charges against Gillette. It establishes a pattern of violence.
As I said, if you run into him, be very careful..
Forgot to add, this message was Dated Jan ’07
Their status and officers are on-line at the Idaho Secretary of State web site.
Search for Idaho Anti-Wolf Coalition at:
The post on democraticunderground.com was dated Jan. 7, ’05 and said the incident happened “several months ago” which would put it in late ’04.
If he was jailed in Boise, that would be information available to the public.
Opps, I goofed, read the date, and forgot to read the year….yikes!
Ralph, the Idaho Anti-Wolf Coalition is incorporated in Idaho as a general non-profit, but Save bears’ search of Guidestar.org doesn’t show it listed as having IRS non-profit status.
If Gillett claims the Idaho Anti-Wolf Coalition has IRS non-profit status, tax-exempt or not, but in reality it doesn’t have the status, he could very well be committing fraud.
The Idaho Anti-Wolf Coalition needs to be throughly investigated.
Idaho Anti-wolf Coalition
A non-profit corporation under the Idaho Non-Profit Corporation Act. Idaho Code 30-3-1
TITLE 30 CORPORATIONS
CHAPTER 3 IDAHO NONPROFIT CORPORATION ACT
I’m not a lawyer and I don’t have time today to look at all of the code to see if there are open book requirements but it should be in the above link.
Razor Ron Gillette was a basketball Guru. Didn’t he coach the Burley Bobcats back in the 70s? Excellent coach until he ran into the FOG. That word alone still sends shivers down his spine……more so than the Candian Grey Wolf does.
When his white cowboy hat fell from his head, Gillett let go and turned around to pick it up, Stone said. She said he then got back into his vehicle and screamed, “If you were a man, I’d beat the crap out of you.”
Lynne, you should have repeated the exact same words to him. He’s not a man.
You folk are just now figuring out something that the “anti” wolf faction (the ones that really investigate things) figured out about two years ago.
After repeated requests for Gillette to come talk to us, or to explain where the $$ went, he simply wouldn’t come thru. At that point most of the hunting/outdoor community that was “in the know” dropped support for Gillette and company and advised others to do so.
I’ll give you another little tidbit here — if you look at the pictures on his website you’ll see that there are a lot of whitetail deer pictured — you’ll also see that there is a couple of captions that say the series of pictures were taken “in the vicinity of Stanley, Idaho”. When was the last time you saw a whitetail deer in Stanley?? There are a few, but not many. Those pictures were actually taken on the North Fork of the Clearwater river. They were published on a couple of internet sites almost two years before they appeared on Gillette’s site.
These “save our elk” photos that are being circulated seem to all be in the Clearwater Country. It doesn’t look like Idaho to the south. I notice that some of the carcasses are the same animal from different angles and one, a headless one, looked to me like a poach. As Layton says, some of these photos have been floating around for several years.. Ralph Maughan
A group desiring IRS non-profit status first incorporates as a non-profit in its state, then applies to the IRS for non-profit status; tax-exempt or not.
Buffaloed, it is established that the Idaho Anti-wolf Coalition is a registered Idaho non-profit corporation; I think the issue now is its IRS non-profit status.
Sounds as if the Idaho Anti-wolf Coalition is an Idaho non-profit corporation but does not have IRS non-profit status.
Now, about those monies received by Gillett…
This is getting very interesting…
Layton, we’ve know about this for a while too.
How likely is it the delisting will take place this year?
Also, I think most threat management experts (Gavin deBecker) would tell you that the more attention and notoriety you give the RGs of the world, the worse they get. Anything obliquely threatening about them would make them more paranoid and dangerous. Anything that feeds their belief that they are persecuted just keeps them going. Take the batteries out of the bunny.
delisting took place today…….
Yes but after the month period- barring the injunctionthe lawsuit(s) will hold it right? It may be that I should have asked will delisting stick this year.
I would imagine, “If it sticks” will depend on what happens in the next 30 days, as far as USFW is concerned, it will stick, and if the next 30 days shows responsible management, I would guess the lawsuits will have a different route to take..
Currently, it will come down to the old adz…..Time will tell, it is in the hands of the states for the next month..
RE: litigation to protect the gray wolf. There was an article in yesterday’s Missoulian about Earthjustice taking this suit to Fed court (when the wholesale slaughter begins). Does anyone know what happened at the District court level? (I’ve been under the weather for a bit)
The case will begin in a federal district court. That means the one in Montana, Idaho, or Wyoming. Most likely it will be Montana
Regardless of what happens over the next 30 days, and I don’t think much will happen, as far as the States are concerned, the key issue of the lawsuit will be that delisting is illegal because it violates the Endangered Species Act and because the plans in Wyoming and Idaho, and to a certain extent in Montana, do not meet the delisting criteria as established at reintroduction.
First and foremost, we do not now have, and the plans clearly intend to obstruct, a functioning wolf metapopulation in the larger recovery area. Second, the delisting criteria requires an adequate regulatory mechanism for wolf management and conservation throughout the recovery area, which includes all of Wyoming. The delisting criteria clearly state that predatory animal status for wolves in Wyoming does not meet the criteria. Equally, recent legal actions in both states make clear the states’ intent to manage wolves at a minimum by maximizing mortality (e.g., Idaho’s recently passed law), which is biologically and ecologically insane, but do clearly reveal the intent to persecute wolves, thus contradicting the requirement for sustainable management and conservation.
If hunters wipe out the packs in Wyoming that exist outside the trophy game zone, which I doubt, that merely adds fuel to the lawsuit. But the fundamental issues don’t change.
There was a complaint filed in molloys court Jan 28 2008. I have the complaint. So now I am very confused.
That is the suit against the new 10j rule which will govern the management of wolves by the federal government should the wolf delisting be overturned.
The federal government (Kempthorne’s DOI) planned the reduction of protection of wolves well. Actually 2 lawsuits need to be won to restore protection.
thanks Ralph. What I have is the complaint for “declaratory relief and injunctive review”. I didnt know there would be 2 based on different legal merit.
What worries me is that it takes forever for a species to be put back on the ESA. and with wolves, don’t know if it would happen.
I love the comment that Ron yelled to Lynne, “if you were a man I would beat the crap out of you”, I don’t think Ron could beat the crap out of himself. Heaven help him if ever does try that on a man. For some unknown reason I want to go spend more time up in Stanley watching wolves.
Have to laugh out loud at your comment Chuck! and remember dancing ladies and whiskey come later!
This is just a little off-subject, but I thought everyone here that is involved with wolves might find this interesting. It is from a discussion on the Yellowstone net forums. This sounds like a very interesting concept that could be used to keep wolves away from livestock and out of trouble.
That very well may be, but I for one believe, there are going to be some very slick golden boys, both in science as well as the legal arena that will weigh in on both sides of the case.
Glad to hear you are doing good Lynne. I’m planning a visit to Stanley this Summer. To shoot photos of course. Gillette’s actions don’t surprise me, seems most small towns have resident psychos who get away with mistreating other people. I’ll be watching this case against him.
I would sure hate to be the lawyer or scientist who had to argue in favor of delisting.
Zen – thanks. I could sure use a photographer with a big lens now as I continue to see a local pack almost daily.
Some nice wild wolf photos would be helpful to use with media and other work. Most images that appear in publication are of wolves with glazed eyes, trying to wake up after been manhandled, I mean collared. Or taken from the air during agency surveys.
My Canon Digital Rebel (3 years old) has a 70-300 mm zoom lens, but it’s not fast enough or “image stabilized” for taking wolf pix at a distance or in dim light.
There are some amazing deals on ebay for lenses and camera equipment. The beauty of it is if you don’t like it you can resell it to someone else for little to no loss. My sister has a fixed focal length 300mm canon lens for the digital rebel and it has taken some amazing distance pictures in yellowstone.
Lynne I might try and make it up there this next weekend, if I get any good shots of wolves, I will let you have a copy of the pictures. Hope all is well up there. Will let you know for sure if I am coming up.
I recently very,very fortunate to be upgraded to a Nikon D300 Digital SLR and also a 70mm-300mm Nikkor lens with VR-vibration reduction. The 70/300 is my favorite lens for close-ups because i don’t need a tripod, which is great for things that move. I will be in YNP in May and anxious to use it in a variety of situations. I would like to come take wolf photos with you, if possible, maybe the 3rd week of May?, or some other time?
You can get my e-mail from Ralph if he does not mind.
I have a D-70 Nikon and lens, a 70/300, with all accessories, plus a great book, to sell. It is like new and i would like to get $450 for it, if anyone is interested??? Last i checked $450 was the price for the body only. I may also have a camera bag to go with also.
Tony Mayer, leader of the group Save Our Elk, took over leadership of the initiative drive from Ron Gillett, director of the Stanley-based Idaho Anti-wolf Coalition.
Mayer, who lives in Twin Falls, said his approach to the issue is different than that of Gillett, who was arrested in March on assault and battery charges after he was accused of attacking a wolf advocate. Gillett has pleaded not guilty in Custer County court.
“Ron has approached the issue from an anti-wolf standpoint,” Mayer said. “We’re defending the elk.”
Mayer said the public should not take the language of the initiative literally. He doesn’t intend nor believe the federal government would remove all of the wolves. Instead, he hopes the initiative prompts a new court case, with the backing of the state, to get a better deal that reduces the number of wolves required in Idaho.
“We have to draw the line in the sand and say enough is enough,” Mayer said.
Did anyone go to their coalition meeting yesterday?
video of the anti-wolf coalition meeting will be available soon
Right on, Brian.
Will it be on you tube like the other one then or will it be posted here? Did they know who you were? That would be scary.
i did not take the footage at the meeting but I can imagine it was uncomfortable.
it’ll be on youtube.